Security these Days


#1

Since 9/11, airports as we all know won’t let you go past security without a boarding pass. I don’t understand that concept. You still can even get on a plane w\o a boarding pass anyway. I know it probably makes congestion a lot better becasue there isn’t so many non travelers walking around the terminals. I know the idea of preventing terroritst from going through security is the main thing, but, if a terrorist wanted to blow up a bomb in an airport, they could do so in the lobby’s. There is just as many people there too. I go to O’Hare a lot and i notice in terminal 1 and 3 being UAL and AA’s terminals, theres is alway a massive amount of people waiting at the desks and in line for security. i would love to be able to take my mom, dad, or girlfriend to the gate when i take them to the airport ro even great me! I miss those days of waiting for loved ones to greet you. The terrorists can do the same amount of damage in the lobby instead of the terminals.

My point is that i want to be able to go through the security checkpoint w\o a boarding pass just like the old days. I don’t see the point the TSA does that. Can you see my point.

Ciao


#2

Security as doled out by the TSA is a facade, an illusion.

While I prefer to be met at the curbside, there are some people that should be met at the gate. I know that one parent can take a child to the gate. However, this is absurd. Both parents should be able to take their child to the gate. Children today are also being denied the fun, excitement, and joy of meeting grandparents as they come off the plane.

There’s a reason why I call the TSA the Terminally Stupid Administration. The TSA randomly selects passengers - quite often little old ladies and children in strollers - to give additional checks yet they refuse to do profiiling of passengers.


#3

It also makes it harder to “switch” passengers. If I happen to be on a no-fly list, I can get somebody not on the list a ticket, we both go through securiity, then he gives me the boarding pass, and I’m on a plane. Only way to stop this would be to recheck ID at the gate (or put a photo ID on the boarding pass!).

Also, it keeps down the number of people who could be trying to slip bad stuff past security to be hidden and picked up by more bad guys later.

As far as the lines, if I remember from LONG LONG ago, there was a stat that only 25-30% of people at the airport were actually getting on or off airplans. The rest were well wishers, etc. That’s a lot of extra folks to send through the lines!

Editing to add that just because the TSA has left gaping holes unplugged (screening cargo, etc) because they seem to focus on preventing the last attack doesn’t mean we need to open holes topside.


#4

Yes, I can. And coming from an airport where the TSA officials let a fake bomb get all the way to AMS, I can’t say I have too much faith in them.


#5

In defence (…ack!) of the Terminally Stupid Association, I would definatly not want to be stuck in line at security behind countless girlfriends, boyfriends, husbands, wives, grandparents, 5th grade classmates, church choirs, soccer teams, fishing buddies and bingo partners get screened through security to meet someone at the gate.
I’d be happy if they gave me a chair to sit on while i put my shoes back on instead of doing the solo hop-scotch shuffle.

"Sometimes i look in the little TV screen they have there, I cant tell ONE thing thats in there…Its my own bag, and I cant even tell what it is. The guy’s sitting there going, “whats that a hairdryer with a scope on it? that looks ok…Some sort of bowling-ball candle? Thats fine…keep it moving, dont hold up the line”
-Jerry Sienfeld-


#6

They have chairs at EWR, so I guess that is one nice feature.


#7

If the screening is effective, no list would be necessary. I don’t care if OBL himself is on board providing he’s not armed or carrying a bomb.

If the screening is effective, no bad stuff gets into the secure area.

Just keep swallowing the party line, folks :blush:


#8

“Security” is my pet peeve! It only stops honest folks and anyone who really wants to can get anything they want through.

If you will recall, the 9/11 hijackers ALL went through the security checkpoint. They were all ticketed passengers. They were carrying weapons that still would not be detected today.

When I was a frequent flyer I watched COUNTLESS cases where TSA did not properly screen passengers, myself included.

I actually carried a pocket knife in my breifcase that was overlooked in screening for about a year after 9/11/2001 and I was traveling every week going through security at least twice a week. I didn’t even realize that I had the knife at first, but when I found it I decided to leave it there and see how long it would take for them to find it. (It was small enough that it would be simply thrown away rather than me getting arrested). About 6 more months! (Good job PVD! Finally. Of course, your folks missed it several times, too.)

I agree that it is better than no security at all and I definately support screenings, but they really should get serious about it. I good start would be prohibiting any carry-on luggage at all. Perhaps compomise by allowing a single hand-carried case or bag no larger than a lunchbox for “essentials”. Sure this would be an inconvenience to many folks, but security would be MUCH better and the lines would move MUCH faster, both through security and when getting on the plane.

Anybody want to get started on how effective an ADIZ is around Washington. Can you guess what my opinion is?


#9

Pat206 said:

If the screening is effective, no list would be necessary. I don’t care if OBL himself is on board providing he’s not armed or carrying a bomb.

Yes, if screening is 100% effective 100% of the time this might be true. but it is not. It it can never be- you can not “inspect in quality” You need to work hard to insure that dangerous items/people never make it to the airport (the world would be alot safer if OBL was in prison instead of on a no fly list [or unarmed on an aircraft!]

I also don’t think security only stops honest folks. By making it more difficult to plan and organize an attack, we make it more likely that that planning and organiztion will be discovered before an attack occurs.

Example:

Pre 911 (as mentioned in the initial post) anybody who wanted to go to the gate could go, provided they were screened. If I want to make a trial run (or 20) of getting 10 people with box cutters to departure gates at BOS, I don’t have to buy them tickets. If they are stopped or questioned, there is no reference to any previous activity (hmmm, this guy has come through the security checkpoint 4 other times today)

Now I need to buy them tickets. Now I need extra phone calls to pay for these. Now I might need extra fake id’s to cover this activity. This means the “sleeper cells” need more comms with other cells and higher level planners. The chatter of the organiztion must increase, and detection probabiility goes up.

This being said-I am assuming that FBI and CIA are communicating in meanging full ways and the NoFly lists etc contain real threats on not Senator Kennedy [ok some of you I’m sure consider him a threat, but be that as it may]. In short we must assume that the quality is built into the system so that threats do not arrive at the airport, rather than crossing our fingers and hoping we catch them 100 steps from the gate. We learned on 911 that this is not the case, and I see no evidence that the situation has improved since.

(Edited because I am trying to inspect in quality to my post and keep finding spelling errors)


#10

I just love how our government scrambles to put Band-Aids on gaping security leaks, ALWAYS after the fact, and usually without much analytical thought involved. Remember after 9/11 when you could no longer carry ANY kind of knife, etc. past security, yet anyone could sit down in an airport restaurant PAST THE TSA SCREENINGS and get a knife? How the hell did the “experts” overlook that?! I agree w/ several of the posts above; I don’t want to be stuck in line behind a bunch of relatives bidding “farewell,” but it does take most of the “fun” out of flying in to meet relatives or friends. I remember looking up the jetway, hoping to see my dad’s smiling face when I used to fly down to visit for the summers as a kid. I don’t think it has anything to do w/ terrorists setting off a bomb in the concourse; if they want mass casualties, they’d just set one off in the middle of the crowd waiting in line at the checkpoint! :confused: :unamused:


#11

That’s interesting! I never thought about the resturants past security. I’m surprized that hasn’t happened yet with someone doing that.


#12

hmm…I think the restaurants are a non issue. as far as I remember they all have plastic flatware…no metal. can’t do much with a plastic knife, it’ll break first. I’ve traveled a lot this year for business. Been mostly through AUS, DFW, AMA, and occasionally ORD. Last week I ate breakfast at Wolfgang Pucks at ORD and they definately have plastic.

only complaint I have, and it’s not with security itself, is people taking half their life’s possessions as carry on. I take a laptop backpack with two laptops (work and personal) and my camera and maybe a book or magazines. I can get through security in 3 minutes unpacking and packing everyting, including shoes/belt. But it takes me 10 minutes to get from jetbridge to my seat cuz everyone is standing in the aisle looking for a place to cram their rolling bag that’s too thick for the overhead. I think they should only be able to take what’s necessary or what’s too fragile for checked bags (laptops, gifts, etc.)

I do agree with the post above about non-paassengers past security. Yeah, I grew up being able to see my parents off at the gate and greet them on the return, or them the same to me. Especially with long international travel. But you wouldnt be able to move around AUS with people everywhere, and yeah I’ve been to Bergstrom before 9/11, I dont know how we did it back then, the place is freaking crowded with just PAX (at peak obviously…) Especially with AA putting their gates next to security so when people get ready to board, no one can get past to their gates.

I just wish Amarillo had their bar on the inside of security, so I could get through and just relax with a cold one before the flight. (I’m sure you could argue against it pretty easy with how much some people in there drink, and being on a flight with an intoxicated person is rather annoying)

i know this is a bit long winded. TSA is there pretty much to be visible that something was done post 9/11. You can never predict every security threat, but you can patch all the historical holes. And if at least those aren’t patched, then something’s really wrong.

going to Cincinnati (CVG) tomorrow (yeah, I know, technically Kentucky), first time so I don’t know if I’ll see anything that changes my mind.

-alan


#13

NOW they have plastic utensils. But just after 9/11, many, if not most, still provided metal ones.