Crash at KMGY

Local news in Cincinnati is reporting a crash off the departure end of KMGY in south Dayton, Ohio. They are reporting 2 dead and a fire.

Last departure listed on Flightaware was N4BA a turbine A36.

UPDATE: Dayton Daily News says that FAA reports the plane to be a Beech Bonanza. … 31568.html

They’re filing as B36T which is the turbine conversion, but the registration says B36TC (turbocharged?) and in the picture it doesn’t look very turbiney.

Doesn’t look very airplaney for that matter…

Poelking Bowling

A bit of digging into this…

If it was N4BA, they’re a FA member it appears: User B36TC (which would confirm the whole Turbo Charged mystery I suppose).

They list their industry as “Health Care” though, not sure if that matters. Can’t find much on Poelking Air, but Poelking Lanes is a chain of bowling places here in Dayton.

One paper here in Dayton (one of those community conglomerate types) believes it to be N4BA, though doesn’t name any sources.

Very sad.

I see a lot of law enforcement poking around the wreckage in the photos. I highly doubt any of them are NTSB, and/or trained in aircraft accident investigation. A very common problem for investigators, cops that don’t realize they are in way over their heads. I once watched a cop trying to measure skid marks on a runway after an aircraft landed gear up. Not quite sure what he was trying to find out, but he threatened to arrest the airport manager for interfering with an official police investigation.

It is. KMGY is the home airport of a very close friend. The irony is that we were speaking at the time when my friend learned of, and confirmed the news…just prior to my above post.

Condolences to those affected. :frowning:

LEO accident investigators are trained to determine velocities from skid/scrape marks, contact area, and the contact materials.

That may be true for ground accidents but are they specifically trained for non-ground vehicle accidents also? A skid mark from an object falling out of they sky would probably have different characteristics from an object that is already on the ground and starts skidding.

In any case, I do not feel it is NOT the responsibility of cops to investigate an aviation accident unless there is clear evidence of a crime. Even in cases of a crime the cops should allow the experts at the NTSB to investigate first. The cops, in my opinion, should not do anything more than keep the evidence intact. In other words, don’t try to be glory grabbing like many cops are and let the experts do their job.

I was primarily responding to davysims’ remark

Not quite sure what he was trying to find out…

of his excerpt that was quoted regarding his…or her :wink:… observation. That is what the LEO was “trying to find out”.

That was a sarcastic remark, we knew what he was “trying” to do. But the principles behind auto vehicle accident investigation rarely have anything to do with aircraft investigation. In that particular incident, it was a simple gear up landing, pilot admitted he goofed. The FAA and NTSB never even investigated since the pilot admitted his error.

My point is, LEOs are not used to being stopped from doing anything. But in the case of aircraft accidents, the only thing they have jurisdiciton to do is setup a perimeter and protect the area. The regulations are pretty specific about that. As an airport firefighter, we train on what to do or not to do with wreckage. Basically, once the people are rescued, and the fire out, we don’t touch anything. And even during the rescue/fire operations, anything we touch, we write down and document, document, document.

Well why didn’t you say so… :wink:

I have flown in N4BA , It is a B36TC, which is a Beachcraft Factory designation and IS NOTa conversion. A B36TC is A36 with longer Baron Wings( 5 or 6 feet longer, helps useful load ) and larger fuel tanks (the B instead of an A) and a factory Turbocharged Engine (TC). Its the FAA database that thinks its a turbine for some reason.

It was a very clean and well maintained plane. The press has been saying cargo door till this news report that has the last audio on the local CTAF … 37018.html

Here is one that I saw last Friday in Apalachicola…I thought something looked different about it…

Hmm, Not the same type of plane N4BA is B36TC.

(1982-2002) A36TC with longer span wing, increased range, re-designed instrument panel and controls, higher take-off weight, 116 built

The one you saw IS a turbine conversion . on the following link It is listed as an A36 N4BA had a 6 cylinder engine.

Maybe its a bug in flightaware or it a thing in the FAA database on since it shows as A36 in the registration but as B36T/G on your link. I It might be so that since it behaves more like a B36T/G and that info is more for a controllers information for how to handle it.

but the plane you saw was originly a A36 then likely modifided by one of the below (agian from Wikipedia)

Propjet Bonanza (A36)
standard aircraft modified by Tradewind Turbines with an Allison 250-B17F/2 turboprop engine (Original STC by Soloy). [6]

Turbine Air Bonanza
B36TC modified by West Pacific Air, LLC and Rocket Engineering with a Pratt & Whitney PT6A-21 turboprop engine.

The defect is the pilot filing B36T. B36T is the code for the turbine conversions. The BE36TC and friends should be filing BE36.

If you look at the history N4BA usually filed BE36, it was only the most recent flight where they filed B36T.

N4BA is owned by a LLC. More then one Pilot. When it filed it might have filed wrong by a paticular pilot or if done over the phone the operator put what he thought he heard.

Here is another one that came to visit near me and it’s classed as a /T also, but in the registration it shows a 300HP Cont. engine where are the other I posted shows the Allison engine you mane note of.

I don’t understand why you would want an un-pressurized aircraft to have a tubine engine? I can see wearing supplemental oxygen masks, but that would seem like a pain. Does a turbine engine operate well at lower altitudes? I would think performance would be reduced, but I don’t know if it would make a huge difference.

Did some looking. That looks like a tradewind conversion. Even same wing tanks. their web page cites BIG performance gains and other things.

I remembered something and did some checking. If you try to setup a flight online using ether with up saying its a A36 with a piston or a B36 and a turbine.

I updated the photos for N4BA. Note the factory graphic saying B36TC. It had been repainted but new decals were made to match the factory original. … tes/page/1

Great power at low altitudes, if you don’t mind the fuel burn.