I took off from klex (Lexington KY) and the cleareance was, clear to Kmkc, Radar Vectors V171 to IIU ( louisville) then direct. So I took off gave me run way heading on take off. I switch over to departure. They said resume own navigation to V171. Can some explain to me what I was supposed to do? I thought you could only enter an airway on an intersection. Your help is much appreciated. Thx
Are you talking about this flight?
flightaware.com/live/flight/N720 … /KLEX/KMKC
You can join the airway anywhere you happen across it. Since this flight never did join V171 I assume (assuming this was your flight) that you received further clearance for direct.
“We have clearance, Clarence”. (ClearAnce, not clearEnce)
Present (runway) heading to intercept the airway. Depending on the wind the intercept point could have been anywhere along a several nm length of the airway. Simple clearance for the controller…simple clearance for you… Fly the heading to where ever you intercept the airway, turn, and track. No fuss, no muss.
That kind of clearance is common. And what a find job you did. 8)
When correcting others, please don’t f*ck up.
He said clearEAnce, not clearEnce
I’m just sayin’…
Read the title. You were only half right.
That’s is my flight. The controller did allow to go direct to IIU. However if she didn’t allow me to do that, then at what ever point I’m at and the controller give the CLEARENCE to resume own navigation then I would pick up the V171 at anypoint I chose as long as I joined it before I arrived at IIU? Thanks for the input and help.
By what you’ve mentioned that ATC gave you, is it safe to assume you departed runway 22 at KLEX? If so, that should have been fine, as well as fine to your previous question. If you departed runway 4, you would have needed a vector at least back to the VOR before joining the airway. But with 22, just basing everything off the back course for the ILS/LOC 4, the IF there is SAAPP, which is on V171. So runway heading would have had you intercepting the airway anyway.
Personally, I would have said “On your present heading, intercept V171, resume own navigation” just so it clears up any ambiguity for which way you’re headed, what to intercept, then set you on your own.
Once again, this is assuming a runway 22 departure.
For someone who flys the victor airways regularly instead of direct due to rental a/c with no GPS, RNAV, or DME it seems like a pretty standard clearance. I do agree the wording makes it a bit confusing.
With no IFR certified GPS I cannot “resume my own navigation” on a vector so technically I couldn’t comply unless I was instructed to “resume my own naviagtion” after the intercept as tyketto stated.
Although you must have a decent avionic setup given your /G equipment suffix.
when I use to fly AMF 422 there was another company flight that’d be heading to LTJ and I’d be given this- AMIFLIGHT 422 turn right 15 degrees then intercept the V122 west of LTJ
Not entirely true. You can “resume your own navigation” using a whiskey compass!
Using a whiskey compass for my primary navigation under IFR? Ahh no thanks…that’s alittle too ballsy for me.
Substituting a VFR GPS for a DME or using an IFR GPS with outdated database for approaches is about as much as I would want to even consider treading into the “grey area” of illegal and unsafe.
Resume own navigation doesn’t imply GPS direct or even use of GPS so you can comply with the instructions resume own navigation. jhwenger just trying to point this out to you via whiskey compass scenario.
Based on ATC instructions, after radar vectors, just twist in the appropriate radial the Victor highway is on for your Nav1 or 2 and intercept (resume own navigation) the highway.
Thank you for everyones input. Its all a big help.
Right, except for safety my understanding is never to intercept a radial without a vector. If your intercept heading is too shallow you may never intercept the airway. You can “guestimate” an intercept based on winds but there is no way to verify the intercept heading will be adequate. Thus I wouldn’t resume my own navigation until I intercepted the airway. If I couldn’t get a vector I would go direct the VOR to get established on the airway.
I suppose if you REALLY needed to establish an intercept with no ATC assistance you could “guestimate” a heading and verify your progress by observing which VOR radials you are crossing in your secondary VOR indicator but this is definitely crude. Now if I had an IFR GPS I would accept the “resume your own navigation” to establish my own intercept because I can verify my exact position and very readily see the intercept heading/angle required to get established on the airway.
In my (limited) realworld experiences I have only received “resume your own navigation” when I was established on course. If I was not yet established I would request a vector or go direct a fix to which I could navigate instead of “guestimating” heading to intercept.
My appologizes for the long winded post. I think perhaps I was mis-understood here in first time around.
What do FARs denote as “primary navigation” because obviously a whiskey compass cannot legallly be used as your primary navigation under IFR, but VORs can.
In the given scenario would (legally) your whiskey compass be considered your primary nav instrument for the intercept if you were to “resume your own navigation” before the airway was intercepted? OR would VOR navigation still be considered your primary nav?
Any FAR/AIM insights would be appreciated…I’m curious to know the legalities of this…
If I understand your question correctly, absent /G ground based equipment is your primary navigation (VOR, LORAN)
GRABCARD shoud jar some training day memories insofar as FAR regs.
GRABCARD isn’t nav instrument tho… it’s assumed if your navigation isn’t GPS, it’s ground based, regardless of the situation: determining intercept heading, on victor airway already, etc?
I’ll dig through the fars when I’m not in class…