What is the Cirrus Killer?


#1

So what is Cessna’s plans? Obviously they have just bought Columbia but do they plan to develop the NGP. 26 million is a lot of money so I am sure they will be less likely to continue with the NGP. So essentially, my question is What is the Cirrus Killer or the competitor to Cirrus.


#2

Cirrus keep coming out with new models, sometimes I thing they are their own competition. I liked the SR-22, then it became the GTS, the Turbo, the G-3, the all new SR-20, they just keep coming.


#3

For me the Mooney is the Cirrus killer, always have, always will be :slight_smile:


#4

While we’d all like to believe that our own plane is the best ever built, at some level you have to deal with market realities. Mooney has sold 59 planes year to date in 2007 while Cirrus has sold 461. Last year Mooney sold 75 airplanes while Cirrus sold 721. If Mooney is killing Cirrus, it is hard to see it from the numbers. The only company that is in contention for the title of Cirrus killer from the overall market perspective would be Cessna+Columbia which together sold 1050 piston aircraft in 2006 and 638 year to date in 2007.


#5

You are absolutely right ofcorse, it was kind of a sarcastic remark from me, to say that i find that Mooney’s are the best Cirrus killers for me…

Seems to be i’m rather the only one, according to the sales figures, i’m pritty sure that even Cirrus did not expect this growth. I’m very very intrested in what we will see with their ‘the jet’.

I still think they are crappy planes, i’m very intrested to see what Cessna will make with their NG and if they are going to add BRS to the Cessna 350 en 400, and some better de-icing (wich is almost impossible with those legs hanging out), that could make a cirrus killer right away if you ask me.


#6

ANN story regarding the ups and downs of Cessnas take over of Columbia, and how it may affect Cirrus.


#7

Yes, i read ANN regulary, it’s a great article. I’m happy for the Columbia owners and i’m really looking forward on THE JET from cirrus, i fly one in X-plane 9 and in the simulator it flies great, let’s hope it it does what the sales data says…


#8

I think Diamond is the biggest competition to Cirrus and Cess-lumbia. From what I’ve seen of the DA-50 at the airshows, it is going to be a great plane.

I’m not sure how the 350/400 will do in the future. Many will disagree with this, but Cessna has shown the ability to successfully market and sell “inferior” products. They should be able to crank out a couple hundred of the 350/400’s every year. This will give some good competition to the SR22 that Cirrus is producing today, but the big unknown is is the next big thing coming out of Deluth.

Textron/Cessna doesn’t have the reputation for being an agile company, so it will be interesting to watch how they operate their new company. Is Cessna’s “cirrus killer” going after the 2006 model and will be out of date when it hits the market? (BTW, someone at Cessna should be fired for acknowledging outside the company they called it a “Cirrus Killer”.)


#9

I agree with you. If the DA50 looks anything like the prototype and flies like the (rumored) specs, it will be a great GA plane. As Sternone reminds us, however, we need to wait and see.

Not sure I can agree with this one. The have come out with the first real VLJ fully certified and flying as specified (and starting years behind the competition), they have acquired one of the top end composite speedster aircraft companies, they have an innovative (though not necessarily beautiful) light sport aircraft with a glass panel, etc. That is surprisingly agile in my book for a big, successful company. I haven’t looked at the numbers recently, but I believe that they are the market leader from LSA through VLJ and into small jets.


#10

I think Diamond is the biggest competition to Cirrus and Cess-lumbia. From what I’ve seen of the DA-50 at the airshows, it is going to be a great plane.

I agree with you. If the DA50 looks anything like the prototype and flies like the (rumored) specs, it will be a great GA plane. As Sternone reminds us, however, we need to wait and see.

I must give you my opinion on the DA50, me too saw and sat in one at Friedrichshafen:

  • they are talking about 200kts @ 75% for the DA50, diamond never got their premilary figures right, like with the DA42, they came up with a plane that is 50 knots slower to the people who bought it on paper!!!
  • They will offer the BRS, like they announced on ‘D-JET’ adding BRS to their new planes is a move to get market share from Cirrus
  • They should have made it pressurised from the beginning (rumours are it’s comming up…the CEO of Diamond said we are going to see a DA-52, if they make it pressurised then and get the Thielert 2,0 straightend out, …
  • The finishing on the DA50 i saw on display was a disaster, it looked like it could fall apart in the air or on the ground, i find this a problem for alot of diamond aircraft
  • common, they can’t make uglier planes than that can they ? But hey, we Europeans never liked ‘Austrian’ design, if it ever exists…i hope the owners of a DA50 admire their ‘flying bathtub…’

#11

To me the Columbia 400 would be a better choice over the Cirrus - primarily because of the G1000. My gripe -all these new high performance singles have that akward control stick. I like a normal yoke.


#12

Just curious as to why? Have you tried flying a side stick like a Cirrus?

discussions.flightaware.com/viewtopic.php?t=3101 for my experiences with a Cirrus.

I’d ditch the yoke in a heart beat if my wallet would allow for it :smiley:

Allen


#13

On the first few flights they do seem a bit awkward, but I found that you get used to them pretty quickly. On these cross-country planes, you mostly fly with autopilot anyway.


#14

Heck, if you get the plane trimmed up even without autopilot like myself, the yoke acts as a great decor for tose long XC’s. This of course is that if your plane is rigged correctly. Of course, I do live in the land of GPS direct, and autopilot will take the bends in the road better from way point to way point.

I just use rudder and yaw for the minor couple of degree correction should that need be there for purposes of ground track.

I thought when I flew the Cirrus, it would be a big issue, but when one thinks about it, for me anyhow, the yoke is in my left hand.

So what difference did it make for landing with the “joy stick” in my left hand. Really none, and I loved the fact that I could keep my elbow on the arm rest with the control at fingertip reach. Like you said, one could really get used to it REAL quick!

On my VFR checkride, the DE set a standard I have yet to reach, but just trying my darndest to do. He did the last landing on my checkride without touching the yoke, all trim, power and rudder.

It’s me afraid to let go of my “security blanket” :smiley: as I feel I am close to that standard.

Allen


#15

Its so funny how almost all these companies rejected the parachute (saying their planes could actually fly without the parachute), and preached about how it adds weight. They all laughed at Cirrus for it. Then they decide to add it (Cessna, Diamond).