Questions about the NY class B


I am an Aproach controller in the NY area and I can answer any questions you might have about why we do what we do. or where is a safe place to be. or any other questions you might have. The way I see it the more you know the easier my job becomes. Im looking foward to hear from you.


Welcome to FlightAware, atc1! It’s nice to have a “resident expert”. I, for one, have never flown through the NY Class Bravo. The only times I came through that way on IFR from coastal NC to BOS area they vectored me half way to Indianna! And that was after a fuel stop in NJ!



Just wanted to say thanks for the great job…I fly into FRG quite a bit and I always get a good deal of “love” from NY Approach…Much appreciated…Only once did I have to sit and wait (1hr) at the hold line for IFR release…I consider that pretty good for the area…Thanks again.



Thanks for the warm welcome. I work the NJ airports (EWR, TEB, MMU, CDW etc.) but the sector that works FRG is in the same building. There are alot of good guys and gals there.



I really appreciate your fielding questions! I am nowhere close to you, but would love to hear what you think on picking up IFR clearances from a remote airport. I am based in Madison MS (MBO) and when I file IFR, I pick up my clearance through a remote outlet via JAN (Jackson MS)

My first question for ya is when it’s severe clear weather, and I want to pick up my IFR clearance, would it be easier on the approach controller if I pick the clearance up in the air VFR or continue to call into clearance delivery and wait my turn.

The CD frequency is manned by the approach controller, so it’s the same person everytime I call into approach.

I fully understand it may be different at each airport and each controller may want something different, but am interested on your take of this question.

I want to be a good neighbor and do my part to contribute to the safety of the system.

I have a few more questions, but won’t inundate you with them very big smile.




Great to have ATC input in a forum like this. I fly my C-210 out of Old Bridge, NJ to the Boston area fairly frequently having 2 kids in school up there. (they turned into Red Sox fans :open_mouth: and my wife wants to disown them). Just to repeat what another poster said, I really think you folks have you act together. Whether I fly IFR or VFR I have always found the interaction professional.


to lieberma: I can’t speak for other areas but, i can try to answer your question based on mine. we also work several uncontrolled airports where the pilot has to call ATC for thier clearance. we have a sepeate postition (Flight Data) to handle those calls. If the radar controllers busy its better if you pick up your clearance on the ground. you can still depart VFR if you want and just call ATC when you are ready to become IFR. It may be different however, if you are calling a center for your clearance. They are better equiped at thier positions to handle flight plans. plus if it is the same exact person you are talking to I can’t see it making a differance. hope that helps.

To bcompitello: Sorry about your kids becoming Red Soxs fans thats got to be tough. 3N6 is just past our airspace into Mc Guires. One of my guys will be talking to you if you ever find youself on 132.8. Talk to you later.


Heya ATC1 - welcome = I’ve called Tracon and never gotten a decent answer to this one -

I own a Turbo Viking - we often travel to/from 73J in SC. I would prefer to fly V1 JFK V229 BDR for my arrival back to IJD. I can easily get to the low flight levels and have done the trip @ FL190 coming north. How come despite being up high [which I define as 14000 and up - above prob. 90% of singles and lots of non-turbine twins] when IFR I get a descent to 5 0r 7000? I can be doing almost or over 200kts of groundspeed and they bring me down and I lose most of decent winds.

It would seem that directly over JFK and to PUGGS if I’m 15000 or 17000 - whose way am I getting into there? The NYC arrivals are always below me by then and the departures are barely getting cleard to the 11000 at that point. I do not understand why they drop me down = I can get around it by canceling IFR, keeping the code [if I’m on top or in betw a layer] and then simply getting a new IFR semi-popup I’m still in the system] from the controller east of JFK if I need one for the descent.

There is the TEC routing which sets the alts as bet 5 and 8k, but I thought that only applied to below 10000? Short of going way offshore is there anything I can do to stay up high? If I’m at FL190 they do not descend me, but then if I’m that high I can easily take the offshore routing since I can glide to the beach from pretty much anywhere.


Hello erisajd,

Anything above 17000 is center airspace so I’m not sure whats available above that. I will list who is in the way on the route and alt you described:
1- EWR and LGA over sea’s dept to the NE they initialy climb to 10000 then to 17000 referance the…
2- JFK NW dept (going to ORD etc.) they climb eastbond till the leave 10000 then turn to the NW ~ 310 heading.
3- JFK arrivals over camrn. cross JFK decending to 13000 then decend SE all the way down for the airport.
4- Im not sure if the bouno arrival to HPN would be a factor. But they come in high from the south and decend to the east till the get under everything till the get turned twards HPN.

Im a EWR controller so im not 100% but, I hope that helps a little. Remember you can do anything VFR. When Your IFR any route alt can be worked out through coordination but, for example if you were to go JFK…BDR@ 15000 that would reqire coordination with at least 3 controllers since it’s not the standard. That increases workload and all it takes is 1 person to say unable and the whole plan is done. there is no coordination necessary for VFR’s. Just a simple handoff. Happy flying!


Hey atc1,

Thanks for posting here and asking if we have any questions! I don’t have any for you to answer at the time, but I thought’d introduce myself. I fly out of both HPN and DXR, so I’m mostly talking with either the LGA area, Islip area or Lib controllers.

I was out visiting N90 last summer “on the island” for a few hours and was able to tour the place. I really enjoyed it and was lucky to have a contact in N90 in the LGA area (Doug A. [who knows my dad, a pilot. They go back to the days when Doug was the HPN TWR chief…].

Patty M. (EWR area) toured us around since Doug was on vacation that day. I hope to get out to the TRACON again soon and also hit the Center (ZNY) in Ronkonkoma on the same day and see their facility.

I have a good amount of ATC knowledge and have studied most of the basics and some of the indepth stuff. I’ve also studied up on quite a few parts of the 7110.65. I enjoy talking to controllers, as I have a lot of real respect towards them and can have an indepth, technical conversation with them. I plan on attending a CTI school and either majoring or minoring in air traffic management. I’m also an online “virtual” ATCS on the “VATSIM” network. I follow NATCA and FAA politics closely too, but that’s a whole other story…heh. You folks do excellent work in N90 and I applaud you and your controllers. I look forward to getting out there again soon.

I may have some questions in the future, and I’ll try and post when I catch some more free time.

Thanks again!

See ya’ on the scopes.


Hello Jason,

I worked over in LGA for 5 years befor I lost my mind and decided to go to EWR. I remember Patty bringing a visitor around not too long ago. I think he was wearing a military uniform. I don’t know if that was you or not. If it was you have to come back when it’s busy. a nice VFR thurs. night on Mugzy when we are on the NE flow will make your head spin. Mugzy works the TEB, MMU, CDW arrivals as well as the EWR overflow to 11 or 29.

Good luck with the CTI program and I’ll talk to you soon,


Hey atc1,

Unfortunately, that wasn’t me. When I was there I got to sit down with North Arrival and Robinsville (in the EWR area), CAMRN sector over in JFK, Liberty Catskill, and the HAARP sector down to LGA DEP (in the LGA area). It was quiet that day, so NA and RBV were the only EWR sectors open. Since traffic was light, the controller on NA explained to me the blocks of airspace and altitude strata he owned, which was interesting.

One of the guys sitting in the JFK Data area asked me what I wanted to do in the future and I said probably to become an air traffic controller. His response was “Nahhh, become a plumber, make more money, and choose your own hours.” The N90 guys are so funny…

The last time I flew through EWR area’s airspace, I was talking with METRO [132.8] for a while and then got the handoff to Allentown. I’ve heard MUGZY can get pretty busy with all the NJ-area airport arrivals (especially when EWR is running the ILS to 22L and sending guys direct TEB).

I have many friends who know Jason Hubbard, who worked EWR area for a while in N90 before transferring to CVG.

My hope is to stay for a long while the next time and get to learn more procedures and general knowledge of the TMU and each area. I only got to see each briefly, so maybe on a lower-traffic day, I’ll be able to tour for a longer period of time and ask more questions.



We’ve probably spoken together on the radio and never known it. I’m a Pilatus PC12 driver, and our company goes into CDW, TEB, MMU and the like all the time. Ill actually be going into TEB tomorrow (today actually, friday) at 10:15 and leaving again at 10:45. Maybe we’ll “chat” after you give me the VOR A for the overhead pattern :slight_smile:
James (Pilatus ***AF, this trip=547AF)


Pilatus 7AF, I’ve probrably talked to you 100 times. thats one of those call signs that you know the type A/C without looking. Sorry i didn’t see your post earlier. My wife is a teacher and she had last week off so I got to spend some quality time with her. That left no time to check the computer. Anyway. hope you enjoy talking to all those characters I work with and I’ll be looking out for you. Talk to you soon.


Hi ATC1,

I enjoy flying the Hudson VFR Corridor from The Tappan Zee down to the Lady. Is it possible to fly up the East river past the Williamsburgh Bridge and end up on Long Island sound? There are helicopter routes such as Central Park and Throgs but is it possible to get clearance to do this in an aircraft (a Diamond Eclipse).
IF it is possible what should I ask for a clearance, do I go through NY approach or La Guardia tower? Any recommended altitude? I usually fly the Hudson at 800-1000.

Thanks in advance.


Depending on LGA’s configuration Im sure its possible. That is LGA towers call though. when your there give them a call on 126.05. It never hurts to ask. Good luck


Hi ATC1. I fly a Cherokee through that airspace from time to time IFR and I’ve never been able to figure out what routing to expect. Going north I usually stop at MIV with a destination of HPN, POU, or SWF. Going south it’s usually out of one of those airports down the coast to either MIV or SBY. It seems like whatever I file I get something completely opposite. After 4 or 5 full route clearance amendments in IMC it stops being funny if you know what I mean. Any guidance?


Obviously amendments are one thing, but have you tried FlightAware’s IFR Route finder?


Hi ATC1,

Quick question for you. I was recently visiting DXR Tower (DXR is class D airspace under LGA area) and they had a new STARS system sitting to be setup. He told me that he thought N90 already had new equipment (STARS), but I told him when I was there last summer you guys still had ACD.

Do you guys still have ACD or did they swap it out for STARS since I was last at the TRACON? If not, do you know of any future plans to update the systems? When I toured N90, Patti told me she didn’t know what you guys would do if they had to replace it all, since it is so busy and traffic levels can be very high.



I hadn’t tried it but I sure will before I fly up there next time.